About two years ago, amid a rise in Artificial Intelligence, particularly Chat GPT, Crux Now spoke with Joseph Vukov about his new book, Staying Human in an Era of Artificial Intelligence. At the time, he reasoned that it was important to write on the topic as people began to wonder at the similarities and differences between the technology and themselves.
“These things are everywhere now, and they look like the sort of thing that a human created, and because of that reaction people are having, it made me start thinking about what does our Catholic tradition say about what it is that makes us human?” Vukov, associate director of The Hank Center for the Catholic Intellectual Heritage at Loyola University Chicago, who studies the intersection of technology and Catholic faith, explained at the time.
“It turns out that when you start thinking along those lines it becomes clear really quickly that while AI is maybe humanlike in some ways, it’s a far cry from what actually makes us human according to the Catholic tradition,” he said.
Fast forward, and those sentiments echo those made by Pope Leo XIV in his first encyclical Magnifica Humanitas: On Safeguarding the Human Person in the Time of Artificial Intelligence, signed by the Holy Father on May 15 and published on May 25.
Crux Now recently caught up with Vukov to discuss the encyclical, and where AI is now compared to two years ago. He noted that it’s abundantly clear how AI is getting woven into every sector of society. He expressed both worry for the future, but also hope in light of Pope Leo’s words.
“The concern is amplified. Two years ago I was thinking much more about algorithmic control of our shopping and media choices, production of text, fake news, and images,” Vukov said. “All of those things are obviously still really important, but once you start seeing AI integrated into the workforce and integrated into the way in which we carry out warfare and all of these sorts of things — all of the sudden that becomes much more pressing.”
“At the same time, I’m also hopeful in that I think the Holy Father’s words have really landed not only in Catholic circles but beyond Catholic circles,” he added. “I’m very encouraged that he was able to get this encyclical out fairly quickly, and because of that, going forward, not only a Catholic voice will be at the table, but that also, just generally, ethics and spirituality, religious concerns, deeply human concerns, will be at the forefront too.”
What follows is more from the conversation. It has been edited for clarity and length.
Crux Now: How important was the timing of the encyclical, considering it’s a year into Pope Leo’s pontificate, how the technology has progressed, and public reactions to it? For example, there are the videos of commencement speeches where students boo when the speaking brings up AI, making it clear the level of concern that they have.
Vukov: Pope Leo’s really continuing the conversation and the line of thinking that Pope Francis started, and I think it was really crucial that it continues. I think it was important and significant that it was the Holy Father’s first encyclical, and published a little over a year into his papacy because it indicates that both the Holy Father and the Church are aware of the importance of the issue, and I think it’s great that the Church is able to speak directly to those booing college students and validate their concerns and try to give them a framework for thinking about precisely what they were booing and why it is so disquieting.
What are your key takeaways from the encyclical?
My initial take is that I really loved the framing that he offered using two biblical images that I really think provide a lot of clarity throughout the discussion. The first image is maybe one that’s a little predictable, though highly appropriate. He talks about building the Tower of Babel. And then he contrasts that with a different image, one that is maybe a little less known, but I also think is very appropriate, and that’s Nehemiah rebuilding the walls of Jerusalem.
In the Tower of Babel people are building a tower out of their own source of pride. In many ways a monument to their own egos. Whereas, in rebuilding the walls of Jerusalem, Nehemiah is taking people out of exile in Babylon, returning to Jerusalem in order to rebuild these walls together, ultimately because there’s going to be the rebuilding of the temple and the re-establishment of worship in Jerusalem.
So, I have these great images that are more complicated than simply saying AI and tech bad or AI and tech good. It’s rather building is OK, including building new technologies, but we want to make sure that we are orienting that building in the right way, particularly oriented towards things like the common good, towards the worship of God, and not oriented simply towards the gratification and exaltation of our own egos.
What do you make of Pope Leo working with Anthropic co-founder Christopher Olah?
I think it was symbolic in many ways.
Number one, Christopher Olah is not Christian, not Catholic. So, it’s really an indication of the way the encyclical is not just aimed at Catholics, but rather aimed at people of goodwill, including those in Silicon Valley. I think it was great to bring someone from Silicon Valley to show that this is an attempt to reach out to people who are shaping these technologies and help direct the conversation. I think it was good in that way.
I also think it was very interesting that, rather than a political figure, it was a co-founder of one of the major AI think labs. I think it’s an indication from the Holy Father of the way in which conversations about AI are going to look different than other big sociopolitical conversations, because in many ways those in the tech industry have power and influence and money all to themselves that in some ways transcends simple nation states.
How difficult has it become for people to stay human in the era of artificial intelligence?
I think it’s becoming increasingly difficult to stay human because AI has slipped into all of these different corners of our lives, and what’s tricky is that many of these choices are not by themselves morally illicit choices. It would be very strange to say that taking a recommendation from Amazon is somehow a sin or morally illicit. Yet, at the same time, as AI is slipping into our lives and taking away just a little bit of our agency, or a little bit of our relationships, or a little bit of the way that we relate to the world, we become just a little bit less human. As AI becomes more integrated, staying human becomes more and more difficult.
That’s why I think it’s increasingly important that both Catholics and Christians, and other people of goodwill, that we really carefully discern where we want to invite AI and new tech into our lives, and where we want to not. We can’t always say yes to everything that’s offered to us, or the danger really is losing a significant part of what it means to be human.